Lore talk:Helgen
Helgen Squad Leader[edit]
This page has very little information as is, and until we get more information on the town in future content, the more relevant content to fill out this page, the better. As such, being named after the town, the Squad Leader's inclusion in the gallery is absolutely necessary, as it is both relevant, and adds more content to this page, hopefully bringing it out of stub status. --Rezalon (talk) 03:51, 18 February 2020 (GMT)
- The inclusion of an image of a character named after a place doesn't necessarily contribute to a page getting out of stub status. For lore pages, it's more about having information about the place, and the quality of that information. I don't have a huge problem with that card art being included here, but I wouldn't say it rounds out the page in much of a meaningful way. More is good, but it doesn't always mean better. The card is named after Helgen, but it doesn't really tell us anything about Helgen. -- MolagBallet (talk) 05:45, 18 February 2020 (GMT)
- For Legends cards we typically do add them to lore pages if they have a settlement in their name (see Lore:Corinthe#Gallery and Lore:Blackrose#Gallery, etc) and the only cases where we omit them is if they're all technically of the same character (see Lore:Camlorn) due to the leveling up system. Lore place galleries can be quite drab to begin with and it doesn't hurt to put card art in the gallery, especially if the settlement is depicted in the art of a character (see Lore:Khuul), and it'd be a shame to omit legends content from the lorespace. Only issue I see with this card would be the Hjaalmarch triskellion but other than that it seems fine to me. The Rim of the Sky (talk) 06:09, 18 February 2020 (GMT)
Arena Oakwood[edit]
What should be done about the earlier settlement at this location, Arena:Oakwood, at this junction of the roads to Arena:Falcrenth, Arena:Neugrad Watch, and Arena:Riverwood?
Is there any more lore about the presence of Helgen here? Only 4E 180 is currently mentioned.
Arena:North Keep is farther to the west, and more closely matches Skyrim:Falkreath Watchtower in both location and connecting roads.
DayDreamer (talk) 22:10, 20 September 2020 (UTC)
Ambushed[edit]
1. Ralof says the LDB was caught "trying to cross the border" and how "you were captured crossing the border". Darkwater Crossing is nowhere near a border, and there is zero indication that Ulfric nor his Stormcloaks were trying to cross any border.
2. The LDB asks Ralof how Ulfric and his compatriots were captured, a question which does not make sense to ask if the LDB was supposedly also present. Ralof explains the whole series of events up until the start of the game from which point we "know the rest". How come? Because we weren't captured at Darkwater Crossing like Ulfric and co were. (Hence our absence on the list)
3. Ralof and Hadvar alike explain the LDB's ignorance of who the Stormcloaks are due to people "down in Cyrodiil" having other things to worry about. A rather odd thing to say if there is zero indication the PC came from Cyrodiil.
4. Hadvar states the LDB was caught "trying to cross the border into Skyrim", which makes no sense if the LDB was captured at Darkwater Crossing.
5. Hadvar states the LDB "picked a bad time to come home to Skyrim", which is another comment which makes no sense if the LDB was captured far from any border crossing.
Nobody in the whole game ever claims the LDB was captured at Darkwater Crossing.
94.210.31.12 12:53, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
- That was the one thing I was confused about. I looked at the map and realised Darkwater was in fact pretty much in the middle of Skyrim. What I don't understand is how Ralof could know LDB was captured on the border if the convoy went straight from Darkwater Crossing to Helgen, as well as the fact that he says LDB walked into the same ambush, implying LDB was at Darkwater Crossing with the rest of the Stormcloaks.
- Honestly I think it would be best to just remove the statement that the convoy was captured outside Darkwater Crossing, to avoid contradictions like this.
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- This inconsistency has been debated for literally 13 years and I don't think anyone's ever managed to agree a satisfactory resolution. For me I think the easiest reconciliation is to assume there were (at least) two different "Imperial ambushes". One at Darkwater Crossing that captured up Ulfric and co, and one at the border that caught the player and Lokir. Ralof then isn't comparing the fact that they necessarily walked into the same Imperial ambush, just that they both encountered an Imperial ambush. Which may well be two of many ambushes that were part of an coordinated effort to capture Ulfric, to which Lokir alludes when he says they were specifically looking for him. --Enodoc (talk) 20:26, 3 October 2024 (UTC)